Episode 1 - Jason & Sam

Bathroom cruising, balloon fetishes, trans sex tips and queefing. These are just a few of the topics we cover in this premiere episode of FRUITBOWL: An Oral History of Queer Sex. Join Dave and his co-host Sam as they talk about intimate topics related to queer sex.

Episode Transcripts

My name's Jason. I'm 47 and I'm from Dallas, Texas.

My parents didn't really do much of a birds and bees type talk with me. So I had to figure it out just from friends. I knew that I liked to look at guys and I liked to think about guys, but I did not know that made me gay. I did not know that until college. Well, I think I started messing around with a friend of mine when I was 12, mostly kissing in our treehouse. It was pretty high up and it had walls. So we could do pretty much anything we wanted. We would just kiss and make out and touch each other. You know? Just like heavy petting I didn't know what else to do at the time.

And then I don't know. It seems like a lot of friends I had would spend the night and we'd end up  blowing each other, making out and then never talking about the next day. And we all had girlfriends, so I assumed that everybody did that with their friends and that didn't make me gay. I just didn't know. I came from a very, very conservative religious household that didn't talk about things like that. But I don't know, it never felt that crazy or dangerous to me because I didn't really know it’s that wrong. And it seemed like everyone that came over wanted to do something like that. I just thought it was a normal activity. Maybe it is. Maybe everybody does that. And they just, we don't talk about it. 

We didn't have the internet growing up. So I had to rely on magazines, and I think the first introduction I had to what sex looked like was from some adult magazines I found at home. My parents had converted the garage into their master bedroom and so I got the real master bedroom and the medicine cabinet came out of the wall and when I opened it up, I found that there was a treasure trove of dirty magazines. And I was going to hide a book that I had bought at 14. I ordered it from some mail order company. Sent it to a friend's house under his mom's name because she worked late. And then after school, every day I would go there and wait for the mail to come. I never told my friend. I never told his mom. I just figured if they caught it, they wouldn't know it was me that ordered it. But I saw it, I threw it in my backpack and ran home with it. It was the dumbest book. It was a glossy photograph book called Boyfriends, and it was gauzy pictures of men on beaches with lace draped over them. There was nothing sexy about it. I'm not even sure there was nudity, but I was excited to get it. I put that book in the woods. Like I looked at it for a few days and then I just threw it in the woods by the house because I didn't know what to do with it. It was a huge coffee table book. It was not a really good thing to order to like, hide and be surreptitious with, but I had no place to hide it because my dad was hiding porn in my hiding place that I thought I had discovered. Even some hardcore stuff. Nothing gay. Just guys and girls. And when I found them I would block out the girls with like pieces of paper so I could just look at the guys. I never told him until one time when I was a senior in high school, he was yelling at me about something I had done. I think I had had some friends over and we watched an R-rated movie and he was very disappointed. And that's when I brought up the fact that he had hardcore porn and then he made a deal with me that he wouldn't ground me if I didn't tell. And I said, "Well, then you should keep that porn where it is." And he did. So it was fine. Yeah.

Well, I grew up in White Rock Lake, which is like central Dallas. I actually gave my first blow job to a stranger at a bathroom at White Rock when I was probably 15. Well, I was riding my bike around the lake and I had to stop in and use the restroom. I didn't know about cruising or anything like that. I did notice that that bathroom always seemed to have people in it. So I just parked my bike and went inside and went up to the urinal, started to pee, and then a guy came to the urinal next to me and, but he wasn't peeing. Like he was just stroking his dick and I got very excited. I was probably 15 and he must've been 23, but he seemed like a, you know, an older man. An adult. And he was really furry and I reached out and touched it and he just pushed me to my knees and I blew him and it was really exciting. It was like the best day of my life. And then when we were done, I asked if we could hang out, maybe go see a movie. I didn't know. And he said that his wife wouldn't like that too much and like sped off in his car. So it was my first introduction to cruising and people being secretive. And it was exciting. I loved it. And I rode my bike there a lot. Yeah, not always successful, but sometimes yeah. I was, I was hooked.  I ended up living with my partner, Matt for 10 years in a house maybe five minutes from where the house I grew up in and we lived directly across the street from that bathroom. So it was like coming home

There was an experience I had that was embarrassing because of how far I let it go without putting my foot down. I met a guy on Grindr, I think. And this was back in Dallas, probably 10 or 12 years ago. And he was attractive, really actually handsome and muscular and probably early thirties and wanted to get together, have some fun. I don't tend to ask a lot of questions on the apps. If we're both looking and we live close, like I figure we'll just figure out what to do when I get there. So I got to his house. He has a really nice house. He's attractive. He's actually more attractive than his pictures. So that was exciting. And I walked into his bedroom, which was covered in balloons, like all over the floor. Balloons. But not with helium. They're just like laying around the floor. Like he'd had a party a few days ago and they had all just kind of fainted. So I didn't really think that much about it. Cause I thought, well, maybe he just had a party and didn't clean up. So we're getting undressed. And while we're getting undressed, he asks if I wouldn't mind walking over, picking up a red balloon and popping it. So I said, "Okay." I walk over, pop the balloon and he gets very excited. He's very happy. He's gleeful that I had done that. So he asked me to do another one and another and another. So I did that. I thought, well, I had never, never heard of anything like that. And I guess in my head I thought I was just helping him clean up. I didn't even know that that was a fetish. So I'm walking around popping balloons. Then he asks me to sit on a few. He had some larger ones, like almost the size of yoga balls, and he wanted me to sit on those until they popped. So I said, "Yes." I tried. I was completely naked at this point and he was really excited and he was really attractive so, you know, I'm usually game for almost anything if it's gonna make someone excited and we're going to have a good time. So I sat on a big balloon and it's squeezing everywhere and it's really hard to make one of those pop and it's also nerve wracking because I knew that I was gonna fall over and hit the floor naked. So I finally got it to pop and I did fall on the floor and it  thrilled him to no end. So he asked me to do it again. I did it again. I don't even know how many I did, but in my head I thought this was going to lead to having sex.  So I kept doing it. Finally he had me in all sorts of various positions, popping balloons, biting them, blowing them up and then until they pop, which is really terrifying. Like a balloon stretches really far before it explodes. I only did that once. And then I told him I didn't want to do that again ‘cause it was -- I don't know. It was killing my mood. So finally he beckons me to the bed and I think, "Oh, we're going to have sex. It's going to be great." So we get on the bed and I go to touch him and he looks at me and he says, "Oh, that's not really my thing. I don't really, I just, if we could just like roll around on these balloons and feel the latex on our skin and won't that be amazing?" And I was like, "Sure, we'll try that." So I am in bed naked. We're rolling around with this guy, but not touching him, on balloons. I don't even like the smell of latex at all. So finally, after five minutes I asked him is if it's going to lead to sex and he says, "No." Like that's his thing. Like he just wants to roll around and balloons and touch them. Which is fine, but I, I just got up, I put my clothes back on, which is always like the most awkward thing when you're having to put shoes and socks and, you know, it's a whole production and you just literally just want to run out the door. And I just looked at him and I said, "You know, I'm happy that you found this thing that you love, but possibly you should tell people before they come over that you're not actually going to have sex with them, because I think that people expect that when you hook up." And he didn't really say anything. So I did. I got my clothes on and I ran out the door and he messaged me for the next month, every day, asking me to come back over and said it was the most fun he had and I'm guessing it's because I'm just a sucker and I stayed way too long in a way longer than anybody else would've put up with. 

And then finally I did have another conversation with him on online just explaining that I didn't want to do that. That wasn't my thing. It was not fun for me. And I noticed a couple of months later, he did have balloons in his profile. In his picture he was standing in a pile of balloons and his little name on Grindr was just "Balloons". So I, I think that I made the world a better place,

I'm mostly a top and it takes me a very long time to to come when I'm fucking, so the guys I'm with generally enjoy the fact that I can go a really long time. And I, and I like to, I don't know, this is so weird. I don't know. I just liked to pound hard and I can do it for a long time and people seem to enjoy that. I guess I'm just really oral cause I really love to give head too. And I, I don't know, I have a lot of reports of people saying they don't come from blowjobs and I tend to get them to come. So I feel like that is a, that's an honor. I really love to eat ass and I love to rim for a long time. And I just discovered the other day that if you weigh about 140 pounds and you're quite small, I can pick you up by the legs and just hold you to my face and hang you upside down. And that was really fun. So he was like 5'6" and probably 140 pounds if that and I generally am with bears and like cubby guys, so it was different to be with somebody so light that you could like pick up and throw around. So he was bent over his bed and I was behind him on my knees eating his ass, and I realized I could hook my arms under his thighs. And as I stood up, he just came up with me, and his ass was like right in my face. And he could suck my dick hanging from my forearms. I have done things like that before, but the people have been supported by, by their arms or some on the head of a bed or over a sofa. I've never suspended somebody in air. 

I left that guy's house. He was super cute and super fun. And he had a great time and I was feeling really self-confident and like I had done a great thing and as I was leaving his place, he lives in a basement apartment with a very low door, and as I was leaving and telling him I had a great time, I creamed my forehead on the top of his door and fell into his kitchen. And I think I got a concussion because I was walking around his backyard for maybe 45 seconds looking for the gate so much so that when I got into my car, he had already texted me to ask if I was okay. So that's a good first impression, I guess. 

I'm really clumsy in life and in bed. So there's been a lot of like standing up in bed and hitting my head on ceiling fans and falling off the bed, ruining the moment. There's a lot of pouring poppers up noses, chipping teeth. It's a roller coaster if you get in bed with me. You never know. I probably should date like a, a masochist because you're, you'll probably end up with bruises.

If someone is not necessarily into me or into you, just move on to the next one. It's not worth putting yourself through hell, trying to get laid with someone who isn't into it. You know, I think I spent a lot of time chasing after people who weren't that interested. And then when I finally convinced them to do it, it wasn't that great.  Just focus on the ones who are into it and you'll have a much better time. I could tell my present day self that same advice. I mean, I'm recently single. So if you want to get black and blue, and have your ass eaten give me a call. 

My name's Sam. I'm 35 and I'm from Boston.

I was around age four when my dad had the talk with me. So I personally don't remember what my dad said specifically, but what I do remember is that he told me about periods. And so my mom was, like, getting a pad or something out of the hallway closet, and I was, like, I don't know, 4? 3? or something, and I was like, "Do you have your period?" And my mom was just like, "I don't really want to talk about that right now." Honestly, that's the only part I remember. My mom was like, "Did you have to tell our kid all of that?" And he was like, "I just wanted to get it all, all done."

But the way that I remember learning about sex is from this book. And it's called, "Where Did I Come From?" And I actually found it online like a couple months ago and I got a copy of it because I love it so much. So I'm happy to show you that if you want, but it's like, it's all these cartoony, cute people and it's super hetero, and one of my favorite, favorite parts of it is where it's like, "Well,"  I think they call it making love, "If making love feels so good, then why don't you do it all day long?" And then they were like, "It's kind of like jumping rope. It's fun, but you can't do it all day long." But yeah, I remember looking through that book a lot.

Once I was a lot older and  it was like, "When two people love each other very much..." and it's like this cute little, like almost twin size bed with a patchwork quilt, and like the mom and the dad, and they're all snuggled. And it's like, "When two people want to be really close there's one way where they can be as close as humanly possible."

Well, we had sex ed in school, but like, I didn't really do any extra exploration. What I do remember though, was in eighth grade, we were doing the school musical and it was like a big deal to everyone in the class did the school musical. So we're all hanging out before rehearsal one day and this one kid was like, "I heard that Marilyn Manson masturbated on stage." And everyone was like, "Ooh." And I was like, "I don't know what that means." Ooh? No. And then I, I remember this very clearly that day I went home. I took the dictionary off of my shelf and I looked at masturbate and I was like, Oh.

So prior to college I identified as a straight girl. So I saw representations of heteronormative attraction everywhere because that's our culture. And so it didn't take any seeking out. You know, I had a massive crush on Leonardo DiCaprio, just like everyone else. I had a massive crush on Johnny Depp and all this stuff. And then I never actually did anything because I was too shy. Not that I had a chance with Johnny Depp or Leonardo DiCaprio. I think I probably had a different experience than a lot of cisgender gay men. As a trans masculine person who is also attracted to masculinity the things that I was seeing out in the world in terms of what I should be attracted to, I was attracted to. I remember in middle school, I found some Playboy magazines in our attic and I would go up there every day and look at these magazines. But what was interesting was that I wasn't at all attracted to the women in them. I just was like, excited that this was illicit material, you know, like getting a taste of something adult. Why don't they have Playgirl?

Dave Q.:  They do. 

Sam: They do?! Well, my, I don't know who collected these magazines. If I had known about that, I wouldn't have needed the internet. Yeah. We had like this old dial up modem and it would take the phone line. And I had to only do that when no one else was home, cause we had one computer in the middle of the house and it was not private. And so like, it took a lot of patience. I think people nowadays just think porn is really fast, but no, when you went to wait like that, it kind of built up. So yeah, I knew from the first, you know, times that I started feeling sexual attraction at all, that I was attracted to cisgender men. So there's a lot of porn out there. And I found myself just finding all the gay stuff, because that was awesome. And I, I didn't put myself in it. I was just like, that is the hottest thing I've ever seen in my life. Also like I hadn't been around naked, cisgender men, hardly ever at all. Like I remember when I was like tiny, my parents would walk around naked, like from the bathroom after a shower to get dressed, like whatever. But besides that, like, I hadn't seen a peen in real life, and porn was really a beautiful way for me to explore those kinds of bodies. I'm trying to remember the early days because, through transition, I had a healthy appetite for porn. Early stuff? I remember that yeah, actually the early stuff, it was easier to load things that were written. Pictures and videos like that stuff took forever to load. So I actually got really into reading stories that people had written and put online and the stuff that I still find most exciting is the real stuff, stories that someone would recount from an experience that they had or whatever, like that was really exciting. And maybe there'd be like one picture that would maybe load and that was super exciting. 

And then when I went to college is when I discovered female masculinity and the fact that girls could look a lot like boys, and that's when things started shifting for me. I saw tons of representations of queer women sexuality. So I saw a ton of super butch female identified people. I saw a good handful of trans masculine people. I'm at a bunch of gender queer people. Yeah, I just, I saw a lot of people dating and hooking up and whatever everywhere around me, because I went to a super queer school.

So my first kiss wasn't until I was 19 and it was in college and there was this girl that I was just like, "I really like this person. I don't really get it though." 'Cause I hadn't felt any kind of attraction to girls before, and she always wanted to wrestle and I was like, "Why do I want to wrestle this person? I don't like wrestling. I hate getting dirty. I don't want to be on the floor, but I really want to wrestle this person." And then I was like, "Oh."

And so that's the person that was my first kiss. Not during any kind of wrestling. And I remember very clearly that she said one day she was like, "One of these days I'm going to have to kiss you," and I was like, "Oh my God, what do I say?" And then immediately I thought of the best thing ever, which was, "I guess, I'll just have to look out for it then." I was really proud of myself. I was like, "That sounded smooth. I think that sounded smooth." And so one night we were in my room, we're hanging out and she finally kissed me. And the funny thing is, that I was like, "Wait, how do I do this? I don't know how to do this. Wait, how do I do this? What am I going to do?" And then instantly the knowledge of Full House came to mind and on Full House, I remember very clearly that DJ told Stephanie just to "Go with the flow," and just to follow the other person's lead. And I was like, "Okay, I got it." And then after the girl that I kissed was like, "You haven't done that before?" And I was like, "No," she was like, "That was really good." And I was like, "Well, good." 

And then the first time I had sex was with my first girlfriend who is not the kiss person. And  I'm pretty sure the first time we did it was at her mom's house over like winter break. And her mom was in the next room sleeping. And like, it was under the blankets. And I think it was exciting because someone else was touching me and that was exciting. But in retrospect, it's really boring. But at the time, like, I didn't have anything to compare it to. And it was, I felt safe and excited and it was probably great, but honestly, I don't even remember anything other than what I just said. I mean, we did it all the time cause she was my girlfriend. And we were together for, it was my longest and only relationship at the time and it was six months and we did it all the time and it was really fun or I just can't really remember much from that first time. But also we had to be quiet cause her mom was right there and so that might've been more exciting too. I mean my best guess? We just used our hands and got each other off and made out at the same time. That's probably what we did. Yeah. I know for sure we didn't do anything more complicated. 

I do know that in my experience, relationships or hooking up or dating as female was like: you get to know the person you go on some dates to kiss, then time goes on, you do it. Dating people in the male world is like, well, first you do it, and then if you like it, then maybe you'll date. And I just think that's so funny. 

At first, I was like, this is ridiculous that this is how men do this thing, but now it's kind of convenient because it's like, well, if that doesn't work, I don't really want to put in all that effort to hang out all the time. Though, that also discounts the idea of like, well, sometimes the first time with someone you gotta like work things out and then it can improve

Hands down, the most embarrassing thing that happens during sex for me is when I queef. I have hooked up with a whole bunch of cis-gender guys now, and it turns out a lot of them have never heard the word "queef" or the process of queefing. So I'll just go ahead and explain it. It's basically farting out of your front hole. That's the terminology I use for that. You can figure it out. And you can't control it at all. There's no sphincter on your front end hole. So if it's going to happen, it's going to happen and it's probably going to be loud and it only happens in particular positions. And so generally I avoid those positions because I've learned. But if I'm with someone and it's the person I'm dating, then it's fine. But if this is a first time with someone, it's probably going to be the only time with someone, I don’t really want to queef in front of them. And like the things about it, that's extra awkward is that it happens, and I like recoil and I laugh. And when you laugh, it compresses everything and pushes more out. So it just, anyway queefing is really embarrassing. God, I don't even like that word and I've just said it like 80 times. You know, if you think about it, like you're jamming air into a space. Why doesn't that happen from butts?

Dave Q.: It does happen from butts!

Sam: Oh!

Dave Q.:  All the time. 

Sam: But it's not called a but queef 

Dave Q.: No.

Sam: And it's just called farting?

Dave Q.: Pretty much. And it does happen after, you know, fucking because that's exactly what you're doing. You're pumping air in there. 

Sam: And it's like, "Where's it gonna go?" So, yeah, I also just have a huge block against farting in front of anyone ever, even if they're someone that I'm incredibly intimate with and have been for a really long time.So queefing I equate to farting, therefore it cannot happen in front of other people and that's the only time it would happen. It doesn't happen when I do things with myself and if it did, I wouldn't care. So yeah, like even my ex boyfriend of like five years when it would happen, I'd be like, "Oh my God!" and we'd both end up laughing, but I'd just be really embarrassed. Also, where does the word "queef" come from? Who made that up? Is it supposed to be an onomatopoeia?  It doesn't sound like "queef." Anyway, I'm just curious. 

Dave Q.: It's a pretty funny word. 

Sam: It's a ridiculous word. 

Dave Q.: Whoever made it up had a good sense of humor.

Sam: And I've literally never said it that many times in my life.

Sam: So I have something called The Move™ and it is specifically for having sex with other trans guys. Dare I toot my own horn. I think I'm really, really, really good at jacking other trans guys off because I know how to do it on me. And I know that bodies are different, but I'm just really proud of this move because when I've done it to other guys, they're like, "Oh my God, what are you doing? I've never felt that! And I'm like, "It's the move." 

There are a lot of different anatomies, but I'm specifically talking about trans guy anatomies for guys who are on testosterone and have been for a chunk of time who haven't had bottom surgery. So like, their-- I just call it a peen. I just think it's the funniest word. So I'm just going to keep calling it that: a trans dick or a trans cock or whatever is a more a sexy time term, but I just think the word "peen" is hilarious. So a trans guy’s peen, when they're, like, pretty big and like excited and it varies person to person, of course, um definitely smaller than my thumb, but, you know, whatever, just picture a thumb for the sake of the discussion. So this thumb, 'cause I'm right handed. So I can only do the move with my right hand. Basically it has to do with rubbing it and tugging it and pressure all at the same time, which I guess doesn't sound that original, but I'm telling you from people who have certain anatomy who used to have to get off a certain way and now can get off a different way, it's very exciting. 

Yeah. I remember exactly when I came up with The Move. I figured it out on myself because what used to work didn't work anymore. Vibration stopped working altogether and I was like, what is happening? And then on time I just figured it out and I was very happy. I think it's not that it wants different stimuli. I mean, maybe that's part of it too, but just literally what I used to do didn't work anymore because the body part changed in size and shape and the nerves probably spread out. I'm not exactly sure. Anyway, it's like that.

I wish that I had known back in the beginning was the fact that I could actually kind of be a gay man someday. In some ways I don't identify as gay or as male, but like that I could be with gay men sexually is something that I never thought was possible. So that would have been awesome to know. It probably would have blown my mind. 

The second thing is that I wished that I had known that we don't have to make rules for ourselves. You don't have to be in a particular box or like a particular thing, or be relegated to a particular type of sexual practice based on who you are, and the sex you were assigned at birth and the gender that you present as. I took a long time to unpack all that stuff. Like, because I present in a masculine way when I was female identified, people assumed that I was a top. People assume that I was into fems. Neither of which are true at all. And it was complicated. And I tried to fit myself into different boxes. So I wish I had known that I didn't really have to do that. And that if I'm just the most genuine version of myself, the most authentic, that things fall into place. 

So now that I live in a small shoe box and I have this beautiful loft twin bed, I'm pretty sure I'm never having sex again. But if anyone's up to the challenge, once I get it bolted to the wall, this is the place to be.